Paul,
I wish I had seen this particular tip before. It answers many questions. Before I saw it, I never knew how far to bring my arms back. I think I have always had my back elbow too close to my side (dropping a grape), but will now make sure I change that.
But I still have one point of confusion: you have given us a trigger for the downswing, over and over, and made it clear the arms are powerless in the downswing. What about the backswing? What is the “trigger,” and what are your arms supposed to feel like when you are taking your backswing? Do they both move together, do you concentrate on the forward arm, or do you focus on the back arm? Would love to hear your response to these questions!
I have some tips on going back. Essentially I want your arms powerless until 3/4 with your body rotation taking the club back. From there to the top you may need some lifting or riding up of this arm to get it into the grapefruit position. Once you get it there and do it for a while it will go there on its own. I do not think of lifting or riding. I allow it to go up there on its own. If you are too flat you would have to lift it up there but either lifting it up or dropping the grapefruit. This takes about 2 weeks to master. I worked on this many years ago. That is how long it took me after someone got me to try the flat swing (never again).
Paul,
Thanks for that comprehensive response. I am thrilled to be able to tell you that this single tip has really “brought it all together” for me. Before you pointed out this issue, my back elbow (left elbow for me), was right next to my side throughout my whole swing. Even though I have been following your other tips for almost a year, I still was not getting the results I had been hoping for. But as soon as I had a chance to try “dropping the grapefruit,” the difference in the feeling of power I got was like “night and day.” I can now actually imagine driving a ball 270 yards or better, something that was always my goal when I started with Ignition Golf, but which I started to doubt I would ever achieve, until you focused my attention on that back elbow in my backswing. Your conclusion about the problems with a “flat swing” is spot on, and one which I now realize has limited the power of my own golf swing for years.
Thanks again for a great tip, and a great response to my questions! You can be sure I will keep working on “dropping the grapefruit,” along with the rest of the fundamentals I have learned from Ignition Golf.
“Drop a Grapefruit ” :very good image to be memorized , Paul ,when going up in the backswing (When I do this move ,I have in mind JIM FURYK to remember me to raise my hands high ,maybe not teh best image to have ,but it works for me !)
Will you show us in a next video lesson what the elbow should do when it goes down to your side and past your core:a lot has been said about the movement of the right elbow down and thru ,starting with BEN HOGAN and the FIVE FUNDAMENTALS OF GOLF.Should it go past the core or just go down to your right side?(As for myself I don’t think at all about this part of the downswing )
This is really important tip as I had a very flat right elbow. Though I could hit some very good draws but many time hitting thin and not getting any divets. Please tell me is it right elbow movement dominating after quarter swing to separate from body or the lead arm propelling. Are there any specific muscle strengthening required which enables this high right elbow.
Flat will lead to thin, pushed, push faded and even duck hooked shots depending on the face relative to the path.
If you are too flat you need to lift the club up into this position until it goes there on its own. This should only take 2 weeks. No special muscles required. Just watch it in a mirror off of your side to know you are doing it right and get the feeling.
This is a huge tip for me!
I have followed along your daily tips for 18 months and never have seen it until I searched for “flying right elbow”. I have been an “over the top” golfer for years. I am now able to “shallow the club” on the way down and strike the ball from the inside with my right elbow tucked against my body. This tip confirms the top of the backswing position for me. Thank you!
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14 Responses to “Back Elbow Position At The Top”
May 29, 2017
garymeyersPaul,
I wish I had seen this particular tip before. It answers many questions. Before I saw it, I never knew how far to bring my arms back. I think I have always had my back elbow too close to my side (dropping a grape), but will now make sure I change that.
But I still have one point of confusion: you have given us a trigger for the downswing, over and over, and made it clear the arms are powerless in the downswing. What about the backswing? What is the “trigger,” and what are your arms supposed to feel like when you are taking your backswing? Do they both move together, do you concentrate on the forward arm, or do you focus on the back arm? Would love to hear your response to these questions!
May 29, 2017
Paul WilsonGary,
I have some tips on going back. Essentially I want your arms powerless until 3/4 with your body rotation taking the club back. From there to the top you may need some lifting or riding up of this arm to get it into the grapefruit position. Once you get it there and do it for a while it will go there on its own. I do not think of lifting or riding. I allow it to go up there on its own. If you are too flat you would have to lift it up there but either lifting it up or dropping the grapefruit. This takes about 2 weeks to master. I worked on this many years ago. That is how long it took me after someone got me to try the flat swing (never again).
Halfway Back: https://ignitiongolf.com/halfway-back/
Extend Left Arm Backswing at 3/4: https://ignitiongolf.com/backswing-three-quarters/
Connection: https://ignitiongolf.com/connection-backswing/
DRILL: Connection: https://ignitiongolf.com/drill-head-cover-armpit/
Powerless Arms vs Floppy Arms: https://ignitiongolf.com/powerless-arms-vs-floppy-arms/
June 4, 2017
garymeyersPaul,
Thanks for that comprehensive response. I am thrilled to be able to tell you that this single tip has really “brought it all together” for me. Before you pointed out this issue, my back elbow (left elbow for me), was right next to my side throughout my whole swing. Even though I have been following your other tips for almost a year, I still was not getting the results I had been hoping for. But as soon as I had a chance to try “dropping the grapefruit,” the difference in the feeling of power I got was like “night and day.” I can now actually imagine driving a ball 270 yards or better, something that was always my goal when I started with Ignition Golf, but which I started to doubt I would ever achieve, until you focused my attention on that back elbow in my backswing. Your conclusion about the problems with a “flat swing” is spot on, and one which I now realize has limited the power of my own golf swing for years.
Thanks again for a great tip, and a great response to my questions! You can be sure I will keep working on “dropping the grapefruit,” along with the rest of the fundamentals I have learned from Ignition Golf.
June 5, 2017
Paul WilsonGary,
Good stuff. Glad we found the missing piece.
It’s a great feeling knowing you have a ton of power. Let’s get you to the next level.
May 29, 2017
RaymondCHASTEL“Drop a Grapefruit ” :very good image to be memorized , Paul ,when going up in the backswing (When I do this move ,I have in mind JIM FURYK to remember me to raise my hands high ,maybe not teh best image to have ,but it works for me !)
Will you show us in a next video lesson what the elbow should do when it goes down to your side and past your core:a lot has been said about the movement of the right elbow down and thru ,starting with BEN HOGAN and the FIVE FUNDAMENTALS OF GOLF.Should it go past the core or just go down to your right side?(As for myself I don’t think at all about this part of the downswing )
May 29, 2017
Paul WilsonRaymond,
I already did this tip here:
Right Elbow: https://ignitiongolf.com/downswing-right-elbow/
I don’t think about it nor have I ever worked on it.
May 29, 2017
VinayBhardwajHi Paul,
This is really important tip as I had a very flat right elbow. Though I could hit some very good draws but many time hitting thin and not getting any divets. Please tell me is it right elbow movement dominating after quarter swing to separate from body or the lead arm propelling. Are there any specific muscle strengthening required which enables this high right elbow.
May 31, 2017
Paul WilsonVinay,
Flat will lead to thin, pushed, push faded and even duck hooked shots depending on the face relative to the path.
If you are too flat you need to lift the club up into this position until it goes there on its own. This should only take 2 weeks. No special muscles required. Just watch it in a mirror off of your side to know you are doing it right and get the feeling.
May 30, 2017
paulwitkowskiGreatest tip for me. Thankyou
May 31, 2017
Paul WilsonPaul,
Glad you liked it. Thanks.
May 30, 2017
BradGoodisonWould your concept of thumbs pointing into the ear produce the same result?
May 31, 2017
Paul WilsonBrad,
Exactly, but this is another way to get people to focus on it.
September 9, 2019
MichaelJansenThis is a huge tip for me!
I have followed along your daily tips for 18 months and never have seen it until I searched for “flying right elbow”. I have been an “over the top” golfer for years. I am now able to “shallow the club” on the way down and strike the ball from the inside with my right elbow tucked against my body. This tip confirms the top of the backswing position for me. Thank you!
September 17, 2019
Paul WilsonMichael,
that’s great. This is a vital position in developing a great top of the backswing position.
Here is a another one that may help:
Back Elbow Position At The Top (grapefruit): https://ignitiongolf.com/back-elbow-position-top/