Hi Paul,
By standing taller with the club in the middle of shoulders and front of knee and over the shoe laces also centering your weight on the correct part of your foot? It would seem so.
Thanks, Mike
Hey Paul. Great explanation – especially for me. You know I started from that hunched over position. Thanks to your instruction and tips, my posture has improved greatly. I did correct one thing by watching this video. I was under the impression that the line from the shoulder to knee to laces started in FRONT of the shoulder. I always felt way too tall when trying to line them up. Now that I understand that it is from the MIDDLE of the shoulder, it makes much more sense and is more balanced over the middle of the feet. Thanks for all of your advice!!
Glad you liked it. Thanks. This is so simple yet few people actually do it. In your case it is essential to get you taller. Why? That lower swing was not working. So let’s try getting you up taller and work on turning more circular. Once you get used to it you will see that this is the best way for you to swing. I think you are seeing it now.
Pat, Glad you are getting the setup. This can be a little tricky. I like the taller setup so the person’s shoulders are not see-sawing in the swing. I like rotation. Just line up the middle of the shoulder, knee and laces as you described and you will be fine.
Paul, thank you for your excellent tip. It is so simple but so effective. Today my swing was not the best and I was pulling my shots slightly left all day. I also noticed that I was not getting the torque and the build-up of pressure on the inside of my right foot during the back swing. Having applied your tip in front of a mirror, the more upright stance certainly gives me considerably more torque at the top of the backswing than I was achieving today on the course and it also helps me to maintain better balance throughout the swing.
A lot of people get hunched over when they address the ball. This is because the proper setup takes some effort. Once the person tilts too much they lose the torque as you experienced. No torque means you will hit with your arms. Hitting causes pulls. Stay taller in your setup like you just tried. Also, make sure you apply the next tip. This should really give you the feeling or torque in your swing. Once you feel it, replicate it on every shot in the future to gain consistency.
I don’t know if you told me this but i find that if i stand straight up and flex my knees first, still with the body straight, until i feel the weight on the balls of my feet and then bend the upper body forward, still staying in an upright postion i am able to make a good swing.
This is a great way to get into the setup. It’s very difficult to be too tilted then raise up into the correct position. By being taller and gradually getting lower, it stops you from ever being too low. Keep doing it.
Standing higher makes my swing easier and makes me dip my head less on the back swing. I have a hard time combining that with your video of how far you stand from the ball (belt buckle to club handle length of thumb to middle finger). If I follow them both it feelsnas though I need to stretch my arms out in front of me to get that spacing. I had always been taught you should let your hands hang down naturally, which puts my hands to close to my body since I’m standing taller. Your thoughts.
One more thing. In your distance video you talk about how this rule doesn’t exactly apply to taller folks since their belt buckle would be higher and so the distance naturally more the middle finger to thumb. I’m guessing the opposite would be true for shorter folks. I’m only 5’6″. So if my distance is less then a completely outstretched middle finger and thumb, that would mean I’d be reaching less for the ball. Is my 5’6″ height enough to make a difference in your rule since you are 5’10”?
I need you to reach your arms out for the ball at the distance I recommend. If you are up too tall and hang your arms down of course they will be too close. Make sure you are not standing up too tall. Double check this distance and make sure it is correct. You cannot swing with your hands too close to your body.
No the reverse does not apply to shorter folks. Do your setup in a mirror. Watch is from the side view and check that the middle of your shoulder, tip of your knee and laces are in line. If you they are it should be perfect.
I posted a questions under weight distribution. At setup, my weight is more on my toes (balls of my feet) than on my heals. My shoulders are definitely along my toe line (beyond my knees). This setup position may be the reason I am on my toes and not the arches (or laces) of my feet.
I like the visual of the middle of the shoulder begin above my knees and laces. My chest was pointing more at the ball than 6 to 8 feet beyond the ball. When I take the proper setup position it works well as my hips turn more easily and I have much less of an urge to use my arms (it is necessary to use ones arms to save the shot if one is falling forward).
Same question as in the other post, do you have any drills to help me engrain the proper setup position? If I don’t think about it I am back on my toes with poor golf shots.
Yes, balls of the feet to me means toes. Avoid this at all costs. Think laces and you will be evenly distributed.
To get this every time you need to rock forward lifting the heels a little then rock back lifting the toes a little. Do this a few times and you will find the balance point. Just remember to do it for a while.
Played well today. Used your method of rocking between my toes and heals to find the center of my feet for balance. Also aligned my shoulders to my knees to the laces of my shoes. Pointed my chest 6 to 8 feet beyond the ball (standing tall). This enabled me during the downswing to turn my back knee along side my front knee more easily for a better hip turn around my center axis without the feeling of falling towards the ball. Also felt the club staying in front of me and not under my shoulders.
I kept thinking of your image of Iron Byron. From the top of my back swing, my knee would start first thus turning my hips (torque). My back side would stay back and counter balance my hip rotation. My hip turn would then pull my right arm (forces – I am a left handed) in front of me along the swing plane (not under my shoulders) with my left elbow staying close to my side thus the lag of the club was maintained. After impact I felt my right arm taking the club to full extension (it is as if my right hand was fully extended prior to impact and after impact handed the club to my left hand which then was fully extend). The swing path finished more in front of me (almost to left field) and less behind my right side (or right field). I was hitting 250 yard drives to the center of the fairway.
Staying centered reduced the need for an over the top swing (did not need to save the shot). However, I do still have to focus on keeping my head behind the ball. Moving my center axis towards the ball or ahead of the ball during the downswing is a swing killer.
I am not to the point that I can repeat the swing consistently but I am working on it. My sense is that I am learning what a real golf swing feels like.
I really sounds like the swing is taking hold and you are starting see some great results. Stay focused. Keep it simple and keep repeating it until it is natural.
I like the Iron Byron image. This is how I figured all this out. My thought was a little different though. I just thought it’s arm would never move unless it’s motor turned it’s driveshaft. This meant I would not hit or help the shot in any way with my arms. I then did 3 practice swings imagining I was the machine and my whole changed instantly.
I have initiated the downswing for many years so I just had to stop hitting. You have the thought of using the lower body to initiate the downswing. You will most likely have to keep doing this for a while until you are god at it. You are starting to see and feel the results so obviously it’s working.
I bought and downloaded the full swing digital DVD. Spent a number of hours today studying your videos. As helpful as your tips are, seeing it all together in sequence was even more powerful. I marveled at your understanding of how Iron Byron worked and your ability to equate the analogous functions performed by the human anatomy.
Understanding that the legs are the motor, the core the shaft, the right arm is the arm on the down swing (lefty golfer) and the left arm is the arm post impact really struck me. It really helped me see how important rotation about an axis is. Understanding that power is transferred most effectively with a free moving hinge via the wrist really struck home with me.
I am but a 25 year beginner 🙂 but more determined than ever to apply your teachings to my swing.
When I uploaded those videos I had to edit them. In this process I thought about if there was anything I should change. Although there are a few minor things I would not change them at all. They are exactly how and what I want to teach. Glad you see it too. Comments like yours reenforce my view of them.
It’s funny that I actually had George Manning (the inventor of Iron Byron) there to back up what I teach and how I see the machine yet people sill continue to bash my instruction. This is getting less and less over the years because enough people are now greatly improving that it’s getting hard to dispute it works. The few first few years were tough though. Now, I really don’t care what people think about my teaching. I know it works and works better than anything I have ever seen. This was the goal. Now, I am just waiting for the whole golf work to find out about it. One day it will happen.
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19 Responses to “Sit On The Edge Of A Bar Stool To Set Up – Part 1 of 2”
May 23, 2012
MikePlummerHi Paul,
By standing taller with the club in the middle of shoulders and front of knee and over the shoe laces also centering your weight on the correct part of your foot? It would seem so.
Thanks, Mike
May 23, 2012
Paul WilsonYes, I would like you to feel the weight on your laces (middle of feet).
May 23, 2012
PatKarnesHey Paul. Great explanation – especially for me. You know I started from that hunched over position. Thanks to your instruction and tips, my posture has improved greatly. I did correct one thing by watching this video. I was under the impression that the line from the shoulder to knee to laces started in FRONT of the shoulder. I always felt way too tall when trying to line them up. Now that I understand that it is from the MIDDLE of the shoulder, it makes much more sense and is more balanced over the middle of the feet. Thanks for all of your advice!!
May 23, 2012
Paul WilsonGlad you liked it. Thanks. This is so simple yet few people actually do it. In your case it is essential to get you taller. Why? That lower swing was not working. So let’s try getting you up taller and work on turning more circular. Once you get used to it you will see that this is the best way for you to swing. I think you are seeing it now.
October 3, 2012
Paul WilsonPat, Glad you are getting the setup. This can be a little tricky. I like the taller setup so the person’s shoulders are not see-sawing in the swing. I like rotation. Just line up the middle of the shoulder, knee and laces as you described and you will be fine.
May 23, 2012
JOHNJACOBSENPaul, thank you for your excellent tip. It is so simple but so effective. Today my swing was not the best and I was pulling my shots slightly left all day. I also noticed that I was not getting the torque and the build-up of pressure on the inside of my right foot during the back swing. Having applied your tip in front of a mirror, the more upright stance certainly gives me considerably more torque at the top of the backswing than I was achieving today on the course and it also helps me to maintain better balance throughout the swing.
May 23, 2012
Paul WilsonA lot of people get hunched over when they address the ball. This is because the proper setup takes some effort. Once the person tilts too much they lose the torque as you experienced. No torque means you will hit with your arms. Hitting causes pulls. Stay taller in your setup like you just tried. Also, make sure you apply the next tip. This should really give you the feeling or torque in your swing. Once you feel it, replicate it on every shot in the future to gain consistency.
May 23, 2012
DarrelStutesmanI don’t know if you told me this but i find that if i stand straight up and flex my knees first, still with the body straight, until i feel the weight on the balls of my feet and then bend the upper body forward, still staying in an upright postion i am able to make a good swing.
Your thoughts. Darrel
May 23, 2012
Paul WilsonThis is a great way to get into the setup. It’s very difficult to be too tilted then raise up into the correct position. By being taller and gradually getting lower, it stops you from ever being too low. Keep doing it.
April 11, 2013
DucVuPaul,
Standing higher makes my swing easier and makes me dip my head less on the back swing. I have a hard time combining that with your video of how far you stand from the ball (belt buckle to club handle length of thumb to middle finger). If I follow them both it feelsnas though I need to stretch my arms out in front of me to get that spacing. I had always been taught you should let your hands hang down naturally, which puts my hands to close to my body since I’m standing taller. Your thoughts.
Duc
April 11, 2013
DucVuOne more thing. In your distance video you talk about how this rule doesn’t exactly apply to taller folks since their belt buckle would be higher and so the distance naturally more the middle finger to thumb. I’m guessing the opposite would be true for shorter folks. I’m only 5’6″. So if my distance is less then a completely outstretched middle finger and thumb, that would mean I’d be reaching less for the ball. Is my 5’6″ height enough to make a difference in your rule since you are 5’10”?
Duc
April 11, 2013
Paul WilsonDuc,
I need you to reach your arms out for the ball at the distance I recommend. If you are up too tall and hang your arms down of course they will be too close. Make sure you are not standing up too tall. Double check this distance and make sure it is correct. You cannot swing with your hands too close to your body.
No the reverse does not apply to shorter folks. Do your setup in a mirror. Watch is from the side view and check that the middle of your shoulder, tip of your knee and laces are in line. If you they are it should be perfect.
Watch:
Set Up Steps: https://ignitiongolf.com/setup-position
July 24, 2013
CameornWolffPaul,
I posted a questions under weight distribution. At setup, my weight is more on my toes (balls of my feet) than on my heals. My shoulders are definitely along my toe line (beyond my knees). This setup position may be the reason I am on my toes and not the arches (or laces) of my feet.
I like the visual of the middle of the shoulder begin above my knees and laces. My chest was pointing more at the ball than 6 to 8 feet beyond the ball. When I take the proper setup position it works well as my hips turn more easily and I have much less of an urge to use my arms (it is necessary to use ones arms to save the shot if one is falling forward).
Same question as in the other post, do you have any drills to help me engrain the proper setup position? If I don’t think about it I am back on my toes with poor golf shots.
July 25, 2013
Paul WilsonCameron,
Yes, balls of the feet to me means toes. Avoid this at all costs. Think laces and you will be evenly distributed.
To get this every time you need to rock forward lifting the heels a little then rock back lifting the toes a little. Do this a few times and you will find the balance point. Just remember to do it for a while.
July 25, 2013
CameornWolffPaul,
Played well today. Used your method of rocking between my toes and heals to find the center of my feet for balance. Also aligned my shoulders to my knees to the laces of my shoes. Pointed my chest 6 to 8 feet beyond the ball (standing tall). This enabled me during the downswing to turn my back knee along side my front knee more easily for a better hip turn around my center axis without the feeling of falling towards the ball. Also felt the club staying in front of me and not under my shoulders.
I kept thinking of your image of Iron Byron. From the top of my back swing, my knee would start first thus turning my hips (torque). My back side would stay back and counter balance my hip rotation. My hip turn would then pull my right arm (forces – I am a left handed) in front of me along the swing plane (not under my shoulders) with my left elbow staying close to my side thus the lag of the club was maintained. After impact I felt my right arm taking the club to full extension (it is as if my right hand was fully extended prior to impact and after impact handed the club to my left hand which then was fully extend). The swing path finished more in front of me (almost to left field) and less behind my right side (or right field). I was hitting 250 yard drives to the center of the fairway.
Staying centered reduced the need for an over the top swing (did not need to save the shot). However, I do still have to focus on keeping my head behind the ball. Moving my center axis towards the ball or ahead of the ball during the downswing is a swing killer.
I am not to the point that I can repeat the swing consistently but I am working on it. My sense is that I am learning what a real golf swing feels like.
July 26, 2013
Paul WilsonCameron,
I really sounds like the swing is taking hold and you are starting see some great results. Stay focused. Keep it simple and keep repeating it until it is natural.
July 27, 2013
Paul WilsonCameron,
I like the Iron Byron image. This is how I figured all this out. My thought was a little different though. I just thought it’s arm would never move unless it’s motor turned it’s driveshaft. This meant I would not hit or help the shot in any way with my arms. I then did 3 practice swings imagining I was the machine and my whole changed instantly.
I have initiated the downswing for many years so I just had to stop hitting. You have the thought of using the lower body to initiate the downswing. You will most likely have to keep doing this for a while until you are god at it. You are starting to see and feel the results so obviously it’s working.
July 28, 2013
CameornWolffPaul,
I bought and downloaded the full swing digital DVD. Spent a number of hours today studying your videos. As helpful as your tips are, seeing it all together in sequence was even more powerful. I marveled at your understanding of how Iron Byron worked and your ability to equate the analogous functions performed by the human anatomy.
Understanding that the legs are the motor, the core the shaft, the right arm is the arm on the down swing (lefty golfer) and the left arm is the arm post impact really struck me. It really helped me see how important rotation about an axis is. Understanding that power is transferred most effectively with a free moving hinge via the wrist really struck home with me.
I am but a 25 year beginner 🙂 but more determined than ever to apply your teachings to my swing.
July 29, 2013
Paul WilsonCameron,
When I uploaded those videos I had to edit them. In this process I thought about if there was anything I should change. Although there are a few minor things I would not change them at all. They are exactly how and what I want to teach. Glad you see it too. Comments like yours reenforce my view of them.
It’s funny that I actually had George Manning (the inventor of Iron Byron) there to back up what I teach and how I see the machine yet people sill continue to bash my instruction. This is getting less and less over the years because enough people are now greatly improving that it’s getting hard to dispute it works. The few first few years were tough though. Now, I really don’t care what people think about my teaching. I know it works and works better than anything I have ever seen. This was the goal. Now, I am just waiting for the whole golf work to find out about it. One day it will happen.