Greetings Coach tell me why you bring the club into address in your right hand i don’t remember a tip on this i’m sure i missed it.I bring the club in with my left hand first so that i can see my thumb and first finger in the position you showed in the GRIP TIP then i wrap my right hand over the left .Straighten my out
. Hi Paul. I was thinking of a way to remember your set-up routine and came up with USB ( a computer term). In this case the U stands for UP, the S stands for SIT, and the B stands for Bend. Computer geeks like myself will easily be able to remember the steps!
This definitely ranks as one of your Top Ten tips Paul. I hope the viewers realize how important this taller set-up is for your technique. So many think they are doing the set-up correctly, but aren’t. I still get sloppy at times and almost always it’s attributable to set-up. Specifically too much tilt, which can get the shoulder turn way too steep & grip more in fingers. It also causes balances issues out on the toes leading to shanks & all other types of misses.
In my opinion the beginning of Tigers demise was when he shifted to the more “modern” golf swing with the more tilted, “left shoulder down” technique that’s preached by so many instructors. Even though he’s a bit taller now it’s not tall enough and it’s so obvious he’s trying to kill it with his arms it’s sad too watch (and hear all his own theories on why it’s not working). Man I wish he’d spend one month with you. Great job!!
Thanks. Glad you liked it. So easy this way to get the perfect set up.
Right. That was his demise and I have said this right when he did it. Why change the best swing of all time? How could he have thought this new swing would be better than the best? You are also right. He still needs to set up a little taller.
I gave him a lesson when he was 17. Would love to work with him again. Not sure how to get a hold of him though.
Let me see. We have two types of tilt: first, the tilt emphasized in this tip to get your spine or body to the right angle to horizontal in a single plane by bending the hips and trunk (lower angle between spine and ground with short and larger angle with long clubs); and, second, the tilt of your relatively straight body or spine with the head back away from the target and further than the hips or pelvis are from the target, which is not emphasized in this tip, right?
Now, using your mantra, you say to just transfer the weight from the right to the left leg (right knee to left knee) with belly toward the target and standing tall at finish, and to use weak arms and supple, hingy wrists.
Here is what I make of this: For the shorter clubs, the first tilt is much larger and the second tilt is much less and as a result, I think that at impact (during the forward swing) both of these tilts tend to lower the right shoulder compared to the left until the ball departs. For the longer clubs, the first tilt is less but the second is much greater, and although it seems that the right shoulder is higher at the start or setup, the resulting position of the left shoulder coming up and the right shoulder coming down at impact (during the forward swing) is almost the same as for the shorter clubs. As a result, somehow, magically the positions of the left and right shoulder are very similar for the shorter and longer clubs. Hence, one swing fits all clubs, almost.
How the body gets from the point of impact to the fully erect standing position facing the target is a mystery to me, but it does happen on a good shot and I accept it by faith alone.
I’ve been searching for something like the feeling three sentences ago about the swings feeling similar because I have felt that my long club swings and short club swings were totally different for a very very long time. Now, I feel that I am close to understanding and executing a single swing properly.
Thanks for all the help! If I am totally off base here, don’t hesitate to set me straight. I can handle it.
First tilt is you tilting to get to the ball. You cannot hit the ball from vertical. I just don’t want people to over tilt. If so you will not coil and uncoil properly.
Second tilt (front view) is you tilted on a slight angle because your back hand is lower on the club than your top hand. I was not talking about this and usually do not spend a lot of time talking about this because you cannot get away from this tilt. You can over do it though which is unnecessary.
For shorter clubs I still want you to stand tall. Tilt too much with lower clubs and you will most likely shank it.
The body tilts in the downswing due to the person moving between the 2 axis. It is like hitting the accelerator on a car. Fire the lower body the mass of the upper body hangs back. This is what creates the descending blow with irons. Longer clubs swing flatter so they don’t hit the ground.
At follow through you are erect overtop of the forward foot (front view) while still tilted (side view)
Also, the amount of body tilt increases the harder you drive the legs:
To get the same feeling you need to stand tall with shorter clubs. Right now I guarantee you are too tilted with shorter clubs. This lead to hitting down on the ball which is totally unnecessary. The club descends due to the body tilt in the downswing. So you stand tall. You coil the shoulders until you are tightly coiled. Then you uncoil with the lower body in the down and through swing.
Great Tip. If you have a video that makes reference to the 16 items we must check on her set up could you list that for me or consider doing one on a future video. I must be missing some of them since I can’t think of 16. Thanks again Bruce
Hi Paul. I’ve been a member of Ignition Golf for some time now. I just wanted to thank you for all you’ve done to improve this love hate relationship with the best game in the world. I have learned so much from your guidance. Before I struggled to break 90 and I now finally break 80 on a regular basis. I attribute this amazing feat to your instruction on setup and chipping technique and of course powerless arms. The one thing that doesn’t work for me is the 80% weight shift to the inside right heel area. I keep learning that there is a large number of great golfers that keep the majority of there weight on the left side and only shift a small percentage on the back swing. If I had to estimate, I’d say that I was 70/30 at address and 60/40 at the top of the back swing. I find that I get a tighter coil and the move to my left side is so much easier as most of the weight is already there. I feel like I can generate more power with this. I hit my 8 iron at least 150 yards and my driver around 260. I’ve had a conversation with one of the better instructors in the state of Connecticut and I asked him that if I were to take a lesson from him if he would want to change this and he said absolutely not. I would really love to hear your opinion on this. You can ask your questions and post your comments below and I’ll get to as many as I can. 😀
Glad you are doing well. I love hearing this kind of feedback. It never gets old.
Not sure why you would be thinking a reverse pivot would allow you to play better. Not sure why you think most pros do not shift their weight. Jim McLean did an article in Golf Digest in 2001 measuring head movement from address to the top. Tour average was 3.6 inches of head movement going back. If you move you head your body mass favors your back foot thus shifting your weight. If you are referring to the “new” swing keeping your head still you need too much lateral motion in the downswing to even hit the ball. If you kept your head still and turned coming down you will be way over the top. By adding this excess lateral motion you are basing your swing on a sideways action instead of a coiling motion. This is why most people doing this head still method cannot hit lower lofted clubs. Plus, every other sport you would play including throwing a ball would have you moving you head and loading the weight.
So not sure what you were doing to not get the weight shift. I would think you are swaying on to the outside of the foot or coiling too much going back.
If you want to keep your head still go ahead. Just realize in no way would I ever teach this as the best players of all time did not and do not keep their head still with more weight on the left than on their right. This is why there is a known term for it as in “reverse pivot” meaning the opposite to what you should be doing. It will interesting how low you can go doing this and how long your back holds out.
Hi Paul,
I’ve been waiting for this tip. Great job. I’m still having few issues adjusting to all the information on the website. One thing I need an answer to. Im a big guy I seem to have an easier time shifting my weight without swaying by moving my left foot back 3 inches at address. I’m not opening my hips but it makes the transition so much easier for me and puts less stress on my left hip. Any thoughts? Thanks
Whatever works for now. Just be careful that in no way is your knees, hips and/or shoulders closed at set up. If so you will be pulling it. These shots can look like good shots. I would put alignment sticks on the ground to double check it.
Hi Paul, how can I avoid my swing getting flat while setting up in an upright position. I notice your swing is on plane, not flat, but mine gets flat when I’m standing tall at address. Ben
You reach up and set the position. Yes, you will feel your arms for a couple of weeks doing this but after you get used to it they go up there on their own.
I had a really discouraging range session 2 days ago and I was trying to do the taller set up. I was practicing pitch shots of which I had been shanking quite a few and getting very frustrated. When I tried what I thought was the taller set up I somehow got worse with the shanks. Today I watched this tip and tried to put it into practice on the range and the results were much more encouraging. When I did the setup properly I hit so many flush chips. I had such a better feeling today and just wanted to thank you. I even recorded myself and it looks to me like I’m getting a little flippy on the pitches which leads me to believe I’m doing it even on normal swings. I checked out your tip on eliminating the flip and can’t wait to try it at the range tomorrow. Thanks again!
Very good. If I had a nickel for every time I was discouraged I would be a billionaire. Just got to fight through it. If you are shanking you are hitting which is getting you onto your toes in the downswing or there are set up issues. Once you get the taller set up you will never shank it again.
Keep in mind my assistant Pete does swing analysis for $20.
well, another “nugget” and a very welcome one! Like most tall guys, I really struggle to find my proper setup and this tip is certainly one of your best on this specific point. No guessing work, straightforward. I will try to focus on it for the next months/years (lol). I did not comment on recent tips, but overall, they are getting better and better and thank you for regularly coming back to swing fundamentals, it helps me to stay on track.
I should have realized sooner that I actually do that. Not sure why it didn’t register. Glad I got the tip out. Funny how tall guys always seem to think they need to get low. If I was tall I would hit it 400 yards.
Yes, little taller would be good. Haven’t had time to get back to you. Course closes on Monday for over seeding. Then I will have time to get back to you. Looked good though. Still a few issues that are hanging on. Please remind me next week.
Years ago at Blue Rock (Cape Cod) I was shown another posture method. If you get a chance to try it I’d like to know if you find it viable. Standing tall hold a golf club with your left hand. and have it touch your face under your nose (chin up), your chest and and your mid section. Sit down (1-2″) and bend from the waist leaving the club in place until your fingers on your right hand touch slightly above the right knee cap. Let the arms hang from this position and grip the club. This procedure creates a less rounded back and shoulders. I am wondering if you consider the final position standing tall enough ? Thanks
Paul,
Could using this method alter one’s club setup if fitted for a specific lie? My clubs are 2 degrees upright and a half inch longer. I have a tall torso and comparatively short legs plus with a thick body my club hangs farther away from my body than yours does when I stand up. The tilting forward doesn’t seem excessive though.
Jim
In your tip “A New Way To Get The Taller Setup”, you look up, sit, then look back down to put just the ball in your field of view. At this point, do you still need to check that your chest is pointing past the ball?
Hi Paul, I follow the BodySwing method.
Now I am faced with the task of buying a new set of clubs (my Golf Equioment has been stolen) Regarding taller setup, I am considering trying my clubs 1-2 degrees upright, even if I probably don’t hit the irons so well first. I think I would get used to it, but of course the fitter only see how I hit the ball with the old setup.
Would that make sense, or it doesn`t matter new fitting.
I want to stand more upright because I have a new knee and now I have a new hip. I am 57 years old and play hcp. 6.1.
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31 Responses to “A New Way To Get The Taller Setup”
August 19, 2015
johnhoyleGreetings Coach tell me why you bring the club into address in your right hand i don’t remember a tip on this i’m sure i missed it.I bring the club in with my left hand first so that i can see my thumb and first finger in the position you showed in the GRIP TIP then i wrap my right hand over the left .Straighten my out
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonJohn,
You bring it in with your right hand so you are open to the target when you approach the ball. Left hand and you will be closed.
Watch:
Set Up With the Back Hand: https://ignitiongolf.com/set-up-back-hand/
August 19, 2015
RonCalabrese. Hi Paul. I was thinking of a way to remember your set-up routine and came up with USB ( a computer term). In this case the U stands for UP, the S stands for SIT, and the B stands for Bend. Computer geeks like myself will easily be able to remember the steps!
Thanks, Ron
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonRon,
Good one. I will tell people this so they can remember it. Thanks.
August 19, 2015
BryanRhoadesThis definitely ranks as one of your Top Ten tips Paul. I hope the viewers realize how important this taller set-up is for your technique. So many think they are doing the set-up correctly, but aren’t. I still get sloppy at times and almost always it’s attributable to set-up. Specifically too much tilt, which can get the shoulder turn way too steep & grip more in fingers. It also causes balances issues out on the toes leading to shanks & all other types of misses.
In my opinion the beginning of Tigers demise was when he shifted to the more “modern” golf swing with the more tilted, “left shoulder down” technique that’s preached by so many instructors. Even though he’s a bit taller now it’s not tall enough and it’s so obvious he’s trying to kill it with his arms it’s sad too watch (and hear all his own theories on why it’s not working). Man I wish he’d spend one month with you. Great job!!
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonBryan,
Thanks. Glad you liked it. So easy this way to get the perfect set up.
Right. That was his demise and I have said this right when he did it. Why change the best swing of all time? How could he have thought this new swing would be better than the best? You are also right. He still needs to set up a little taller.
I gave him a lesson when he was 17. Would love to work with him again. Not sure how to get a hold of him though.
August 19, 2015
CarlPetersonLet me see. We have two types of tilt: first, the tilt emphasized in this tip to get your spine or body to the right angle to horizontal in a single plane by bending the hips and trunk (lower angle between spine and ground with short and larger angle with long clubs); and, second, the tilt of your relatively straight body or spine with the head back away from the target and further than the hips or pelvis are from the target, which is not emphasized in this tip, right?
Now, using your mantra, you say to just transfer the weight from the right to the left leg (right knee to left knee) with belly toward the target and standing tall at finish, and to use weak arms and supple, hingy wrists.
Here is what I make of this: For the shorter clubs, the first tilt is much larger and the second tilt is much less and as a result, I think that at impact (during the forward swing) both of these tilts tend to lower the right shoulder compared to the left until the ball departs. For the longer clubs, the first tilt is less but the second is much greater, and although it seems that the right shoulder is higher at the start or setup, the resulting position of the left shoulder coming up and the right shoulder coming down at impact (during the forward swing) is almost the same as for the shorter clubs. As a result, somehow, magically the positions of the left and right shoulder are very similar for the shorter and longer clubs. Hence, one swing fits all clubs, almost.
How the body gets from the point of impact to the fully erect standing position facing the target is a mystery to me, but it does happen on a good shot and I accept it by faith alone.
I’ve been searching for something like the feeling three sentences ago about the swings feeling similar because I have felt that my long club swings and short club swings were totally different for a very very long time. Now, I feel that I am close to understanding and executing a single swing properly.
Thanks for all the help! If I am totally off base here, don’t hesitate to set me straight. I can handle it.
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonCarl,
First tilt is you tilting to get to the ball. You cannot hit the ball from vertical. I just don’t want people to over tilt. If so you will not coil and uncoil properly.
Second tilt (front view) is you tilted on a slight angle because your back hand is lower on the club than your top hand. I was not talking about this and usually do not spend a lot of time talking about this because you cannot get away from this tilt. You can over do it though which is unnecessary.
For shorter clubs I still want you to stand tall. Tilt too much with lower clubs and you will most likely shank it.
Stand Tall with Short Clubs: https://ignitiongolf.com/stand-tall-short-clubs/
The body tilts in the downswing due to the person moving between the 2 axis. It is like hitting the accelerator on a car. Fire the lower body the mass of the upper body hangs back. This is what creates the descending blow with irons. Longer clubs swing flatter so they don’t hit the ground.
At follow through you are erect overtop of the forward foot (front view) while still tilted (side view)
Also, the amount of body tilt increases the harder you drive the legs:
Impact Tilt With Different Clubs: https://ignitiongolf.com/impact-tilt-different-clubs/
Spine Angle Follow Through: https://ignitiongolf.com/follow-through-eyes-tilted
The body is erect over the forward leg due to creating the second axis in your swing between your head, body and lead leg:
Cause and Effect – Keeping Head Still: https://ignitiongolf.com/cause-and-effect-keeping-head-still/
Coiling: https://ignitiongolf.com/learn-coil-backswing
Uncoil 1: https://ignitiongolf.com/uncoil
Uncoil 2: https://ignitiongolf.com/uncoil-follow-up
To get the same feeling you need to stand tall with shorter clubs. Right now I guarantee you are too tilted with shorter clubs. This lead to hitting down on the ball which is totally unnecessary. The club descends due to the body tilt in the downswing. So you stand tall. You coil the shoulders until you are tightly coiled. Then you uncoil with the lower body in the down and through swing.
Never Purposely Hit Down On The Ball: https://ignitiongolf.com/never-hit-down/
August 19, 2015
BruceJespersenGreat Tip. If you have a video that makes reference to the 16 items we must check on her set up could you list that for me or consider doing one on a future video. I must be missing some of them since I can’t think of 16. Thanks again Bruce
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonBruce,
Here you go:
How To Fix Your Own Swing: https://ignitiongolf.com/setup-16-things/
August 19, 2015
PaulDInceccoHi Paul. I’ve been a member of Ignition Golf for some time now. I just wanted to thank you for all you’ve done to improve this love hate relationship with the best game in the world. I have learned so much from your guidance. Before I struggled to break 90 and I now finally break 80 on a regular basis. I attribute this amazing feat to your instruction on setup and chipping technique and of course powerless arms. The one thing that doesn’t work for me is the 80% weight shift to the inside right heel area. I keep learning that there is a large number of great golfers that keep the majority of there weight on the left side and only shift a small percentage on the back swing. If I had to estimate, I’d say that I was 70/30 at address and 60/40 at the top of the back swing. I find that I get a tighter coil and the move to my left side is so much easier as most of the weight is already there. I feel like I can generate more power with this. I hit my 8 iron at least 150 yards and my driver around 260. I’ve had a conversation with one of the better instructors in the state of Connecticut and I asked him that if I were to take a lesson from him if he would want to change this and he said absolutely not. I would really love to hear your opinion on this. You can ask your questions and post your comments below and I’ll get to as many as I can. 😀
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonPaul,
Glad you are doing well. I love hearing this kind of feedback. It never gets old.
Not sure why you would be thinking a reverse pivot would allow you to play better. Not sure why you think most pros do not shift their weight. Jim McLean did an article in Golf Digest in 2001 measuring head movement from address to the top. Tour average was 3.6 inches of head movement going back. If you move you head your body mass favors your back foot thus shifting your weight. If you are referring to the “new” swing keeping your head still you need too much lateral motion in the downswing to even hit the ball. If you kept your head still and turned coming down you will be way over the top. By adding this excess lateral motion you are basing your swing on a sideways action instead of a coiling motion. This is why most people doing this head still method cannot hit lower lofted clubs. Plus, every other sport you would play including throwing a ball would have you moving you head and loading the weight.
So not sure what you were doing to not get the weight shift. I would think you are swaying on to the outside of the foot or coiling too much going back.
If you want to keep your head still go ahead. Just realize in no way would I ever teach this as the best players of all time did not and do not keep their head still with more weight on the left than on their right. This is why there is a known term for it as in “reverse pivot” meaning the opposite to what you should be doing. It will interesting how low you can go doing this and how long your back holds out.
August 19, 2015
JosephWachtelHi Paul,
I’ve been waiting for this tip. Great job. I’m still having few issues adjusting to all the information on the website. One thing I need an answer to. Im a big guy I seem to have an easier time shifting my weight without swaying by moving my left foot back 3 inches at address. I’m not opening my hips but it makes the transition so much easier for me and puts less stress on my left hip. Any thoughts? Thanks
August 19, 2015
Paul WilsonJoseph,
Glad you liked it. Thanks.
Whatever works for now. Just be careful that in no way is your knees, hips and/or shoulders closed at set up. If so you will be pulling it. These shots can look like good shots. I would put alignment sticks on the ground to double check it.
How To Put Down an Alignment Stick Properly: https://ignitiongolf.com/alignment-stick-placement/
Change Clubs Change Alignment: https://ignitiongolf.com/change-clubs-change-alignment/
August 20, 2015
BenedictCoffeyHi Paul, how can I avoid my swing getting flat while setting up in an upright position. I notice your swing is on plane, not flat, but mine gets flat when I’m standing tall at address. Ben
August 20, 2015
Paul WilsonBen,
You reach up and set the position. Yes, you will feel your arms for a couple of weeks doing this but after you get used to it they go up there on their own.
Watch:
Too Flat: https://ignitiongolf.com/backswing-are-you-too-flat
DRILL: Half back and up: https://ignitiongolf.com/half-back-and-up
Where The Club Should Be At The Top: https://ignitiongolf.com/club-at-top/
August 20, 2015
NathanAlastraPaul,
I had a really discouraging range session 2 days ago and I was trying to do the taller set up. I was practicing pitch shots of which I had been shanking quite a few and getting very frustrated. When I tried what I thought was the taller set up I somehow got worse with the shanks. Today I watched this tip and tried to put it into practice on the range and the results were much more encouraging. When I did the setup properly I hit so many flush chips. I had such a better feeling today and just wanted to thank you. I even recorded myself and it looks to me like I’m getting a little flippy on the pitches which leads me to believe I’m doing it even on normal swings. I checked out your tip on eliminating the flip and can’t wait to try it at the range tomorrow. Thanks again!
August 20, 2015
Paul WilsonNathan,
Very good. If I had a nickel for every time I was discouraged I would be a billionaire. Just got to fight through it. If you are shanking you are hitting which is getting you onto your toes in the downswing or there are set up issues. Once you get the taller set up you will never shank it again.
Keep in mind my assistant Pete does swing analysis for $20.
August 20, 2015
PierreBourgeoisHi Paul,
well, another “nugget” and a very welcome one! Like most tall guys, I really struggle to find my proper setup and this tip is certainly one of your best on this specific point. No guessing work, straightforward. I will try to focus on it for the next months/years (lol). I did not comment on recent tips, but overall, they are getting better and better and thank you for regularly coming back to swing fundamentals, it helps me to stay on track.
Pierre
August 20, 2015
Paul WilsonPierre,
I should have realized sooner that I actually do that. Not sure why it didn’t register. Glad I got the tip out. Funny how tall guys always seem to think they need to get low. If I was tall I would hit it 400 yards.
Glad you like the tips. Thanks.
August 20, 2015
Raoul BintnerPaul,
Wow ! This makes a dramatic difference ! Still wasn’t tall enough, this will solve the problem.
Take care,
Raoul
August 20, 2015
Paul WilsonRaoul,
Yes, little taller would be good. Haven’t had time to get back to you. Course closes on Monday for over seeding. Then I will have time to get back to you. Looked good though. Still a few issues that are hanging on. Please remind me next week.
December 14, 2015
LenKoblenzHi Paul,
Would the taller setup position with the shorter clubs cause one to compensate by standing closer to the ball?
Len
December 15, 2015
Paul WilsonLen,
Not if you measure your distance to the ball.
Watch:
Stand Tall with Short Clubs: https://ignitiongolf.com/stand-tall-short-clubs/
September 3, 2018
JohnSujatYears ago at Blue Rock (Cape Cod) I was shown another posture method. If you get a chance to try it I’d like to know if you find it viable. Standing tall hold a golf club with your left hand. and have it touch your face under your nose (chin up), your chest and and your mid section. Sit down (1-2″) and bend from the waist leaving the club in place until your fingers on your right hand touch slightly above the right knee cap. Let the arms hang from this position and grip the club. This procedure creates a less rounded back and shoulders. I am wondering if you consider the final position standing tall enough ? Thanks
September 3, 2018
Paul WilsonJohn,
If I am understanding it it seems fine. Why not just do mine. It’s easier. The looking up is the key to getting the curve out of the back.
A New Way To Get The Taller Setup: https://ignitiongolf.com/new-way-taller-setup/
You can do this in seconds.
December 10, 2018
Abbot KSnowThanks Paul. You told us this somewhere back in the basics. Thanks for reminder to stand tall!!
January 13, 2019
JimBenjaminPaul,
Could using this method alter one’s club setup if fitted for a specific lie? My clubs are 2 degrees upright and a half inch longer. I have a tall torso and comparatively short legs plus with a thick body my club hangs farther away from my body than yours does when I stand up. The tilting forward doesn’t seem excessive though.
Jim
February 22, 2019
GaryAdairIn your tip “A New Way To Get The Taller Setup”, you look up, sit, then look back down to put just the ball in your field of view. At this point, do you still need to check that your chest is pointing past the ball?
Gary
February 24, 2019
Paul WilsonGary,
No the looking up will get you in perfect position.
February 2, 2020
iomioHi Paul, I follow the BodySwing method.
Now I am faced with the task of buying a new set of clubs (my Golf Equioment has been stolen) Regarding taller setup, I am considering trying my clubs 1-2 degrees upright, even if I probably don’t hit the irons so well first. I think I would get used to it, but of course the fitter only see how I hit the ball with the old setup.
Would that make sense, or it doesn`t matter new fitting.
I want to stand more upright because I have a new knee and now I have a new hip. I am 57 years old and play hcp. 6.1.
Thanky you in advance
Alwin (Germany)